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Post by unafied on Jul 6, 2018 4:14:05 GMT -6
I think that's what's up with the last minute venue change. This is about to get political. So you're against having something really nice in the area that we all can use, not just basketball. Hmmmm Just to clarify my position here: I am definitely NOT against an arena that is done correctly. I want UNA and the entire Shoals area to grow. There’s no fear of change here. That being said, I do have reservations. After reading the article, it’s clear to me that like so many pie-in-the-sky projects that have been proposed for the Shoals over the years, this is another example of one where some folks have put the cart in front of the horse. I remember in either August or October of last year, there was an article in the TD, quoting Senator Melson I believe, that said they hoped to break ground “in the spring”. But now they are turning around during the meeting yesterday and talking about feasibility studies? Well hold up. I’m no developer, but shouldn’t a feasibility study be conducted BEFORE you start talking about breaking ground? And as for the arena itself, it has been touted as the key piece to this puzzle. Now they’re saying if it doesn’t make sense, they can cut it out of the project and sell the land. That doesn’t inspire confidence. I very much want this to be the kind of kind of project that impresses us all and gives families in the area a place to go for concerts, events, etc. I want a modern arena with seating for 8000+ that is the crown jewel of the ASUN, and coveted by teams from all around. But like I said a couple of posts back, I DO NOT want a half-assed, underfunded boondoggle that is a rodeo arena they slap a basketball court down in the middle of and try to pass as a D1 arena. If it’s not something we can all be proud for them to hang a UNA logo from, then I don’t want the University to waste money being a part of it. And catscratchfever, if there’s any “tone” in this post, understand that it’s not aimed at you. Just the “leaders” of the area that continue to underwhelm me at every turn.
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Post by tuna85 on Jul 6, 2018 7:08:12 GMT -6
Not being from the Shoals area I can't speak to the politics of the area. Regardless, UNA should not place it's planning and destiny in the hands of others. I think the situation with Braly is a good example of what can happen. UNA should proceed forward as if the Ag Center will never happen.
Make Flowers the best it can be now and have a living long range plan on what do, how to fund, where to be and when for the time when Flowers can't get the job done. Should the cities, counties, etc..ever get their act together...well they can approach UNA and UNA can negotiate from a position of strength as we will not be dependent and can walk away. Keep our backs out of the corner.
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Post by unafied on Jul 6, 2018 7:43:54 GMT -6
Not being from the Shoals area I can't speak to the politics of the area. Regardless, UNA should not place it's planning and destiny in the hands of others. I think the situation with Braly is a good example of what can happen. UNA should proceed forward as if the Ag Center will never happen. Make Flowers the best it can be now and have a living long range plan on what do, how to fund, where to be and when for the time when Flowers can't get the job done. Should the cities, counties, etc..ever get their act together...well they can approach UNA and UNA can negotiate from a position of strength as we will not be dependent and can walk away. Keep our backs out of the corner. To make a long story short, the Shoals area has for a long time had elected officials or sleazy developers dangle shiny projects in front of them, only for said projects to end up being either total disasters or something that never gets built in the first place. A short list would be: 1. The Renaissance Tower, that was supposed to have a hotel/conference center from the very start, but ended up losing money for ~20 years before all the parts were finally finished. It might be still losing money, who knows. 2. David Bronner and the Retirement Systems of Alabama wanting to build some grand "tourist attraction", along with the RTJ golf courses. Obviously the golf course happened, and I'm sure it brings in some tourists, but we sit here ~15 years later with no tourist attraction nor any good idea of what it would be in the first place. 3. Various road projects that were badly needed, and promised, but took years to build (or are still ongoing). I'm looking at AL 157, the Patton Island Bridge, US 43, etc. I'm sure there are more, but I'm only 35 and can only speak for the last few decades. I think CSF and I are on the same page but looking at two sides of the same coin. He is worried about the NIMBYs, the people who will literally criticize anything. Jeff Bezos could stroll into the Shoals tomorrow and offer to build the new Amazon headquarters there, bringing in hundreds if not possibly thousands of high-paying jobs and transforming the area forever, and there would be people against it. These folks will certainly critique the ag center no matter how much of a good idea it seems to be. Meanwhile, I'm just worried about the spineless "leaders" who will bow to this group, and possibly ignore the usual silent majority who either thinks it's a good idea or doesn't mind if it happens. At that point the project usually either gets scrapped or cut back so far in scope that it goes from being something truly unique, to (at best) a resounding "meh". I'm simply looking at this from a UNA perspective. I'd love to see the ag center done as originally talked about, with exhibition space, new classrooms (or was it a whole new tech school?), and the ~10,000 seat arena. But I ONLY want UNA involved, and thus spending a tiny part of money I give as an alum, if it will be beneficial. If the arena is done it needs to be a forward-thinking project that incorporates whatever is needed for modern D1 basketball games, concerts, etc. Reading today's article gives a hint that they are already thinking about scaling it back, and if that's the case, my opinion would be for UNA to pull out of the project.
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Post by tuna85 on Jul 6, 2018 8:26:25 GMT -6
Not being from the Shoals area I can't speak to the politics of the area. Regardless, UNA should not place it's planning and destiny in the hands of others. I think the situation with Braly is a good example of what can happen. UNA should proceed forward as if the Ag Center will never happen. Make Flowers the best it can be now and have a living long range plan on what do, how to fund, where to be and when for the time when Flowers can't get the job done. Should the cities, counties, etc..ever get their act together...well they can approach UNA and UNA can negotiate from a position of strength as we will not be dependent and can walk away. Keep our backs out of the corner. To make a long story short, the Shoals area has for a long time had elected officials or sleazy developers dangle shiny projects in front of them, only for said projects to end up being either total disasters or something that never gets built in the first place. A short list would be: 1. The Renaissance Tower, that was supposed to have a hotel/conference center from the very start, but ended up losing money for ~20 years before all the parts were finally finished. It might be still losing money, who knows. 2. David Bronner and the Retirement Systems of Alabama wanting to build some grand "tourist attraction", along with the RTJ golf courses. Obviously the golf course happened, and I'm sure it brings in some tourists, but we sit here ~15 years later with no tourist attraction nor any good idea of what it would be in the first place. 3. Various road projects that were badly needed, and promised, but took years to build (or are still ongoing). I'm looking at AL 157, the Patton Island Bridge, US 43, etc. I'm sure there are more, but I'm only 35 and can only speak for the last few decades. I think CSF and I are on the same page but looking at two sides of the same coin. He is worried about the NIMBYs, the people who will literally criticize anything. Jeff Bezos could stroll into the Shoals tomorrow and offer to build the new Amazon headquarters there, bringing in hundreds if not possibly thousands of high-paying jobs and transforming the area forever, and there would be people against it. These folks will certainly critique the ag center no matter how much of a good idea it seems to be. Meanwhile, I'm just worried about the spineless "leaders" who will bow to this group, and possibly ignore the usual silent majority who either thinks it's a good idea or doesn't mind if it happens. At that point the project usually either gets scrapped or cut back so far in scope that it goes from being something truly unique, to (at best) a resounding "meh". I'm simply looking at this from a UNA perspective. I'd love to see the ag center done as originally talked about, with exhibition space, new classrooms (or was it a whole new tech school?), and the ~10,000 seat arena. But I ONLY want UNA involved, and thus spending a tiny part of money I give as an alum, if it will be beneficial. If the arena is done it needs to be a forward-thinking project that incorporates whatever is needed for modern D1 basketball games, concerts, etc. Reading today's article gives a hint that they are already thinking about scaling it back, and if that's the case, my opinion would be for UNA to pull out of the project. Probably most don't think of it this way but, UNA is the big tourist attraction for the area and needs to be promoted more. Think of all the students and parents that come to tour the school. Think of the potential number of fans of other teams who come to the various athletic events. If I was the local chamber of commerce, I would try to have a site on campus where I could answer parents (and opponent fans) questions about the area and promote the offerings of the Florence/Shoals area. If I was any business, dependent on sales volume, I would want to attract this crowd and would work with the University to do it. If I was the University, I would do all I could to promote the area. Work with the entertainment industry to have concerts in the auditorium of local talent. Work towards a vibrant downtown area. Have state wide invitational tournaments for different sports. Heck I know auburn and bama get to host state football championships but there is no saying UNA couldn't host a Baseball season Kickoff Tournament. Take advantage of our location and host teams from Alabama, Tennessee and Mississippi. There is a huge economic engine between UNA the Shoals and Florence. It just needs folks working together to prime the pump. Seize on the strengths.
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Post by northalaspectator on Jul 6, 2018 8:26:47 GMT -6
I’m very skeptical on how it is being handle.
Possibly more comments from me at a later date.
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Post by brandon on Jul 6, 2018 8:26:59 GMT -6
Something about the article is giving me an uneasy feeling. I don't know what it is, but my gut is saying, if it does happen, then it will be another Longhorn Arena, nothing more, nothing different. And that would suck for anything other than rodeos or 4H events.
I got the same tone on some other projects that was supposed to be one way and turned out just a shell of what it was supposed to be.
I want this to be what everyone wants it to be, but I got a gut feeling it's going to be a huge disappointment.
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Post by unafied on Jul 6, 2018 9:12:34 GMT -6
To make a long story short, the Shoals area has for a long time had elected officials or sleazy developers dangle shiny projects in front of them, only for said projects to end up being either total disasters or something that never gets built in the first place. A short list would be: 1. The Renaissance Tower, that was supposed to have a hotel/conference center from the very start, but ended up losing money for ~20 years before all the parts were finally finished. It might be still losing money, who knows. 2. David Bronner and the Retirement Systems of Alabama wanting to build some grand "tourist attraction", along with the RTJ golf courses. Obviously the golf course happened, and I'm sure it brings in some tourists, but we sit here ~15 years later with no tourist attraction nor any good idea of what it would be in the first place. 3. Various road projects that were badly needed, and promised, but took years to build (or are still ongoing). I'm looking at AL 157, the Patton Island Bridge, US 43, etc. I'm sure there are more, but I'm only 35 and can only speak for the last few decades. I think CSF and I are on the same page but looking at two sides of the same coin. He is worried about the NIMBYs, the people who will literally criticize anything. Jeff Bezos could stroll into the Shoals tomorrow and offer to build the new Amazon headquarters there, bringing in hundreds if not possibly thousands of high-paying jobs and transforming the area forever, and there would be people against it. These folks will certainly critique the ag center no matter how much of a good idea it seems to be. Meanwhile, I'm just worried about the spineless "leaders" who will bow to this group, and possibly ignore the usual silent majority who either thinks it's a good idea or doesn't mind if it happens. At that point the project usually either gets scrapped or cut back so far in scope that it goes from being something truly unique, to (at best) a resounding "meh". I'm simply looking at this from a UNA perspective. I'd love to see the ag center done as originally talked about, with exhibition space, new classrooms (or was it a whole new tech school?), and the ~10,000 seat arena. But I ONLY want UNA involved, and thus spending a tiny part of money I give as an alum, if it will be beneficial. If the arena is done it needs to be a forward-thinking project that incorporates whatever is needed for modern D1 basketball games, concerts, etc. Reading today's article gives a hint that they are already thinking about scaling it back, and if that's the case, my opinion would be for UNA to pull out of the project. Probably most don't think of it this way but, UNA is the big tourist attraction for the area and needs to be promoted more. Think of all the students and parents that come to tour the school. Think of the potential number of fans of other teams who come to the various athletic events. If I was the local chamber of commerce, I would try to have a site on campus where I could answer parents (and opponent fans) questions about the area and promote the offerings of the Florence/Shoals area. If I was any business, dependent on sales volume, I would want to attract this crowd and would work with the University to do it. If I was the University, I would do all I could to promote the area. Work with the entertainment industry to have concerts in the auditorium of local talent. Work towards a vibrant downtown area. Have state wide invitational tournaments for different sports. Heck I know auburn and bama get to host state football championships but there is no saying UNA couldn't host a Baseball season Kickoff Tournament. Take advantage of our location and host teams from Alabama, Tennessee and Mississippi. There is a huge economic engine between UNA the Shoals and Florence. It just needs folks working together to prime the pump. Seize on the strengths. Believe it or not, I do think there has been improvement in this area. Remember in the early 2000s all the talk was for the Shoals to be a "retirement community"? Thankfully most of that has died out. I have absolutely nothing against retirees and want them to come to the area if that's their desire, but that is simply no way for an area to grow and prosper. What we've seen in the years since then is, like you mention, the downtown areas really start to redevelop. There have been a ton of articles lately, in well-respected publications, talking about how great the area is. Last week it was Reader's Digest, calling Florence one of America's "15 Underrated Cities", and saying it's a good alternative to visiting Nashville. That's some serious good pub. A lot of it comes from all the cool things happening not just in Florence, but also Sheffield and Tuscumbia. I absolutely think Florence should market themselves as a "college town". It seems like they've always shied away from it, like they want to be all these other things, but "oh yeah we have a college too". Maybe now they'll want to piggyback on UNA being a D1 school and finally try to use that as a promotional tool.
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Post by catscratchfever4 on Jul 6, 2018 10:32:27 GMT -6
To make a long story short, the Shoals area has for a long time had elected officials or sleazy developers dangle shiny projects in front of them, only for said projects to end up being either total disasters or something that never gets built in the first place. A short list would be: 1. The Renaissance Tower, that was supposed to have a hotel/conference center from the very start, but ended up losing money for ~20 years before all the parts were finally finished. It might be still losing money, who knows. 2. David Bronner and the Retirement Systems of Alabama wanting to build some grand "tourist attraction", along with the RTJ golf courses. Obviously the golf course happened, and I'm sure it brings in some tourists, but we sit here ~15 years later with no tourist attraction nor any good idea of what it would be in the first place. 3. Various road projects that were badly needed, and promised, but took years to build (or are still ongoing). I'm looking at AL 157, the Patton Island Bridge, US 43, etc. I'm sure there are more, but I'm only 35 and can only speak for the last few decades. I think CSF and I are on the same page but looking at two sides of the same coin. He is worried about the NIMBYs, the people who will literally criticize anything. Jeff Bezos could stroll into the Shoals tomorrow and offer to build the new Amazon headquarters there, bringing in hundreds if not possibly thousands of high-paying jobs and transforming the area forever, and there would be people against it. These folks will certainly critique the ag center no matter how much of a good idea it seems to be. Meanwhile, I'm just worried about the spineless "leaders" who will bow to this group, and possibly ignore the usual silent majority who either thinks it's a good idea or doesn't mind if it happens. At that point the project usually either gets scrapped or cut back so far in scope that it goes from being something truly unique, to (at best) a resounding "meh". I'm simply looking at this from a UNA perspective. I'd love to see the ag center done as originally talked about, with exhibition space, new classrooms (or was it a whole new tech school?), and the ~10,000 seat arena. But I ONLY want UNA involved, and thus spending a tiny part of money I give as an alum, if it will be beneficial. If the arena is done it needs to be a forward-thinking project that incorporates whatever is needed for modern D1 basketball games, concerts, etc. Reading today's article gives a hint that they are already thinking about scaling it back, and if that's the case, my opinion would be for UNA to pull out of the project. Probably most don't think of it this way but, UNA is the big tourist attraction for the area and needs to be promoted more. Think of all the students and parents that come to tour the school. Think of the potential number of fans of other teams who come to the various athletic events. If I was the local chamber of commerce, I would try to have a site on campus where I could answer parents (and opponent fans) questions about the area and promote the offerings of the Florence/Shoals area. If I was any business, dependent on sales volume, I would want to attract this crowd and would work with the University to do it. If I was the University, I would do all I could to promote the area. Work with the entertainment industry to have concerts in the auditorium of local talent. Work towards a vibrant downtown area. Have state wide invitational tournaments for different sports. Heck I know auburn and bama get to host state football championships but there is no saying UNA couldn't host a Baseball season Kickoff Tournament. Take advantage of our location and host teams from Alabama, Tennessee and Mississippi. There is a huge economic engine between UNA the Shoals and Florence. It just needs folks working together to prime the pump. Seize on the strengths. Problem is, Florence has had 50 years to do this but all they came up with is a 2,000 seat prom rental. Since an arena is something ALL the citizens can use, they will never do it.
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Post by catscratchfever4 on Jul 6, 2018 10:44:25 GMT -6
Probably most don't think of it this way but, UNA is the big tourist attraction for the area and needs to be promoted more. Think of all the students and parents that come to tour the school. Think of the potential number of fans of other teams who come to the various athletic events. If I was the local chamber of commerce, I would try to have a site on campus where I could answer parents (and opponent fans) questions about the area and promote the offerings of the Florence/Shoals area. If I was any business, dependent on sales volume, I would want to attract this crowd and would work with the University to do it. If I was the University, I would do all I could to promote the area. Work with the entertainment industry to have concerts in the auditorium of local talent. Work towards a vibrant downtown area. Have state wide invitational tournaments for different sports. Heck I know auburn and bama get to host state football championships but there is no saying UNA couldn't host a Baseball season Kickoff Tournament. Take advantage of our location and host teams from Alabama, Tennessee and Mississippi. There is a huge economic engine between UNA the Shoals and Florence. It just needs folks working together to prime the pump. Seize on the strengths. Believe it or not, I do think there has been improvement in this area. Remember in the early 2000s all the talk was for the Shoals to be a "retirement community"? Thankfully most of that has died out. I have absolutely nothing against retirees and want them to come to the area if that's their desire, but that is simply no way for an area to grow and prosper. What we've seen in the years since then is, like you mention, the downtown areas really start to redevelop. There have been a ton of articles lately, in well-respected publications, talking about how great the area is. Last week it was Reader's Digest, calling Florence one of America's "15 Underrated Cities", and saying it's a good alternative to visiting Nashville. That's some serious good pub. A lot of it comes from all the cool things happening not just in Florence, but also Sheffield and Tuscumbia. I absolutely think Florence should market themselves as a "college town". It seems like they've always shied away from it, like they want to be all these other things, but "oh yeah we have a college too". Maybe now they'll want to piggyback on UNA being a D1 school and finally try to use that as a promotional tool. No they suceeded. We swapped industry for retirees. Florence is one of the most highly rated retirement cities when it comes to "bang for the buck." Every time you turn on the radio, Huntsville, Madison or Decatur are proudly announcing 300 NEW JOBS. Florence? A new housing development for seniors and.... A NEW PANDA EXPRESS! DON'T get me wrong. I don't want so much growth that we get the high crime rates that come with it. But it would be nice if 80% of our UNA grads were working and living HERE, not in Nashville, Huntsville, Memphis, etc.
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Post by unafied on Jul 6, 2018 11:23:06 GMT -6
Believe it or not, I do think there has been improvement in this area. Remember in the early 2000s all the talk was for the Shoals to be a "retirement community"? Thankfully most of that has died out. I have absolutely nothing against retirees and want them to come to the area if that's their desire, but that is simply no way for an area to grow and prosper. What we've seen in the years since then is, like you mention, the downtown areas really start to redevelop. There have been a ton of articles lately, in well-respected publications, talking about how great the area is. Last week it was Reader's Digest, calling Florence one of America's "15 Underrated Cities", and saying it's a good alternative to visiting Nashville. That's some serious good pub. A lot of it comes from all the cool things happening not just in Florence, but also Sheffield and Tuscumbia. I absolutely think Florence should market themselves as a "college town". It seems like they've always shied away from it, like they want to be all these other things, but "oh yeah we have a college too". Maybe now they'll want to piggyback on UNA being a D1 school and finally try to use that as a promotional tool. No they suceeded. We swapped industry for retirees. Florence is one of the most highly rated retirement cities when it comes to "bang for the buck." Every time you turn on the radio, Huntsville, Madison or Decatur are proudly announcing 300 NEW JOBS. Florence? A new housing development for seniors and.... A NEW PANDA EXPRESS! DON'T get me wrong. I don't want so much growth that we get the high crime rates that come with it. But it would be nice if 80% of our UNA grads were working and living HERE, not in Nashville, Huntsville, Memphis, etc. Or Chattanooga, like me. Anyway, I agree, the lack of industry is frustrating. I think there are some reasons beyond the Shoals' control as to why they get passed over when it comes to new jobs. Lack of an interstate, having to compete with bigger cities, etc. Probably a lot of the issues that other cities of that size are facing. But like it's been said in this thread, the growth of UNA is one thing the area could really throw its weight behind and likely see a positive outcome.
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Post by 1949lions on Jul 6, 2018 11:33:04 GMT -6
I think the public just wants to know more and the good-ole boys are shocked by that. The met with 100 folks and did a poll? I'd like to see the legit findings of that poll. I'm skeptical of that.
Basically, we deserve to know what's going on and that ticks Melson off.
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Post by catscratchfever4 on Jul 6, 2018 11:52:00 GMT -6
I believe all of the studies have already been done and Melson misspoke.I don't think the governor would have delivered $4,000,000 to the Shoals otherwise.
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Post by Lion2001 on Jul 6, 2018 20:18:53 GMT -6
No they suceeded. We swapped industry for retirees. Florence is one of the most highly rated retirement cities when it comes to "bang for the buck." Every time you turn on the radio, Huntsville, Madison or Decatur are proudly announcing 300 NEW JOBS. Florence? A new housing development for seniors and.... A NEW PANDA EXPRESS! DON'T get me wrong. I don't want so much growth that we get the high crime rates that come with it. But it would be nice if 80% of our UNA grads were working and living HERE, not in Nashville, Huntsville, Memphis, etc. Or Chattanooga, like me. Anyway, I agree, the lack of industry is frustrating. I think there are some reasons beyond the Shoals' control as to why they get passed over when it comes to new jobs. Lack of an interstate, having to compete with bigger cities, etc. Probably a lot of the issues that other cities of that size are facing. But like it's been said in this thread, the growth of UNA is one thing the area could really throw its weight behind and likely see a positive outcome. When they build that multi billion dollar music amusement park, the city and university size will explode! 😜
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Post by catscratchfever4 on Jul 7, 2018 15:01:27 GMT -6
Something about the article is giving me an uneasy feeling. I don't know what it is, but my gut is saying, if it does happen, then it will be another Longhorn Arena, nothing more, nothing different. And that would suck for anything other than rodeos or 4H events. I got the same tone on some other projects that was supposed to be one way and turned out just a shell of what it was supposed to be. I want this to be what everyone wants it to be, but I got a gut feeling it's going to be a huge disappointment. Let's face it. Without the described arena, there will be no concerts, NBA preseason games, A-sun Tournaments or high profile tournaments of any kind, even if we put diamonds on the walls of Flowers. It will still seat only a little over 3,000. The 70s and 80s are over. You aren't going to get big names like the Doobie Brothers, Alabama, Toto etc, like we got back in the day, in our tiny gym. But, I'm sure if we get anything, it will be another 2,000 seat building with a concrete floor with wooden backboards. Why do I think that?.... Tradition.
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Post by tuna85 on Jul 7, 2018 17:18:22 GMT -6
Something about the article is giving me an uneasy feeling. I don't know what it is, but my gut is saying, if it does happen, then it will be another Longhorn Arena, nothing more, nothing different. And that would suck for anything other than rodeos or 4H events. I got the same tone on some other projects that was supposed to be one way and turned out just a shell of what it was supposed to be. I want this to be what everyone wants it to be, but I got a gut feeling it's going to be a huge disappointment. Let's face it. Without the described arena, there will be no concerts, NBA preseason games, A-sun Tournaments or high profile tournaments of any kind, even if we put diamonds on the walls of Flowers. It will still seat only a little over 3,000. The 70s and 80s are over. You aren't going to get big names like the Doobie Brothers, Alabama, Toto etc, like we got back in the day, in our tiny gym. But, I'm sure if we get anything, it will be another 2,000 seat building with a concrete floor with wooden backboards. Why do I think that?.... Tradition. What happens with the Ag Center, planning or otherwise is a Shoals area (government) decision. I truly wish the best for the area. UNA needs to support and garner support from the area. That being said, my two cents worth, UNA should not make plans based on an Ag Center. If it happens great, but don't chase the facility, rather, should the facility come about, let it chase UNA. UNA might get better terms. Just the thoughts from a fellow who is absolutely no expert in the politics of the area.
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